"We All Bring Our Own Human Histories," with Shae Noble, on Trauma-Informed HR, Being a Third Culture Kid Growing Up, Serving Others, and The Abundance Mindset.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hello everyone. Welcome back to the Intersection, uh, podcast program that's about personal journeys and professional journeys, of course, and intersectionality. And I'm really honored actually to have our guest here today. Um, her name is Shay Nobo, and she is a trauma informed HR consultant. And she and I actually met online a few years back and, and I think we saw each other here and there in town over the years, but I think it was like this year we connected more. And I actually, I'm very grateful, um, for Shea because you actually got me one of my first clients when I first started my practice, you know, years ago. So I still remember and thank [00:01:00] you for bringing me clients. Um, and without further ado, I want to invite Shay to introduce themselves to us. Hi Shay.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hi. Well first of all, thank you for that awesome, uh, intro. I didn't realize that, but I'm always happy to support a friend and a fellow practitioner who I know will do a great job. Um, and, uh, so yeah, I, um, have been working in HR for 15 years and founded Trauma-Informed hr, which is based on my experiences working in a trauma-informed environment as my first HR director role years ago.

And then working in tech and other areas and seeing that we really need those same principles applied in all work environments. Um, personally, I'm a little bit of a transplant to Portland, um, although this is now the longest I've lived anywhere. Um, so I'm calling it home now. Um, prior to that I moved around a lot.

Um, I [00:02:00] grew up overseas in Okinawa, Japan, when my dad was a contractor for the military.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hmm.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And so in my adult life, I moved just about every summer, lived in 15 different states. Um, really got to see, uh, the world and the nation. Um, and now I am, you know, uh, trying to raise children in the same school so they don't have the same dislocation experience that I had.

Um, even though it was wonderful, um, it was also, you know, hard to find my place in the world. So. Um, so yeah, I'm really excited to chat with you today, Joe, and just, um, get to connect deeper, um, in the ways that we do when we go out to coffee and things like that.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: exactly. Um, I can't, you lived in 15 states in the us.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: And you live, you grew up in Japan, and did you live in other countries as well?

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: No. Um, my family moved there when I was in elementary school and we were supposed to be [00:03:00] there for two years. We ended up staying for five and so I did get to see a lot of Asia while I was there. Um, and that really formed a lot of. Who I am and how I see the world. Um, and I think too, uh, it taught me how America could be, I think because, you know, growing up in the military there was a lot of, I had very diverse teachers.

I had very di diverse class. Um. Peers. And so coming back to the US uh, was a bit of a shock in middle school, um, to a, you know, somewhat remote area, Spokane, Washington, and that's where I did my, um, middle school and high school years. Um. And then, yeah, and then through college my, um, ex-husband had different jobs that would move us to different places, and it was really interesting living in different states because you get a different taste of the people and the culture than you do just visiting in like a one or two week [00:04:00] trip.

Um, and so I actually have gotten to where I don't like to travel as much. If I'm not gonna actually be living there and get to really experience it, um, like, you know, cruise, you're there for, you know, maybe six hours. I don't feel like you really get to see, um, I, I kind of feel like it doesn't, I mean, it does count as travel, but in a way it's like, it doesn't exactly count as travel.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, it's very different.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: It's not as immersive. As, yeah, I, I can relate to that as well. And I feel like your lived experience in different continents for sure, and then in different states that are exposed you to so many kinds of cultures and just customs, and I didn't know this before of course, but it makes so much sense that, um, you have gone down these, uh, trauma informed HR paths because you realize, you, you recognize the intersectionality of. Um, you know, different worlds, different societies and different people.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.[00:05:00]

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: that's really, really cool.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, I feel so blessed to have had those experiences. Um, and then now as an adult too, I'm like, okay, I think I need to get out again at some point, um, and experience that again as an adult because it's probably very different than what I remember, um, from when I was younger.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. Oh, I'm sure. Like even now when every time I go home I feel like, huh. That's different from what I remembered. Um, so talk about. Your experience in HR the last 15 years, and then what makes you decide like, Hmm, this is what I wanna do. I wanna pursue trauma informed hr, and this is my career.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, so I'm trying to think what the real catalyst was. Um, but I think I just started noticing that my style of HR was very different. Um. One of the things I started to notice were just patterns, and one of the patterns was that, I think it was like six jobs in a row I [00:06:00] took over for somebody named Lori, and they were all different.

Spellings, but they were all women of about the same age, about the same ethnicity, and about the same haircut.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Wow. Wow.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And I started kind of like just, I was like, that's a coincidence. That's a coincidence. And then I realized, I'm like, actually, I don't think it's that much of a coincidence because

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hmm.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: you know, Lori was a very popular name at a certain time.

And, um. You know, I think about my own like mother. She was really talked into teaching as a career and I was very set on. I didn't want like a woman or like a female dominated industry. I wanted something that was more broad. And so I chose human resources and getting into human resources and realizing that it is somewhat feminized.

Um.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hmm.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: In terms of the business world, um, and that we're asked to take on a lot of those roles. Um, and really the time that I came into the workforce was a time when [00:07:00] technology had really taken off. And so a lot of my jobs were modernizing our technology. So I started out doing HRIS and recruitment online.

Um, a lot of the. Modernizing and helping the business catch up with the technology that was available to us. And so, um, when I started realizing that, you know, it's a very white female dominated industry, that's one thing that kind of taught me that like. We need, we need to work through these systems that kind of lead us into certain careers.

Um, and so that, that was part of it. And then, um, working in a trauma-informed environment. I went to a conference to, uh, help the. Um, the company become trauma informed and I was so excited. I opened up the binder and I'm looking for the different, you know, there's, there's stuff for the clinical [00:08:00] team, there's stuff for admissions team, and I was thinking, oh, there'll be something for hr.

And I looked and there was no guidance for hr and. So, um, so yeah, and then just seeing how different ways that people handle things, um, when you have, I mean, I was really thrust into a job where I wasn't prepared as a person for handling some of those things. I mean, even something as simple as somebody having a medical diagnosis.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Right.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Or the really serious things like one of our employees relapsed. Um, 'cause we were in an environment where they're hearing about drug use and they maybe have a history of drug use. So learning how to navigate that. Um, and you know, I was also working for a, a center that was serving indigenous populations.

And so how do you apply human resources and the legal advice you're getting from your attorneys when you know somebody's coming from a background that's been [00:09:00] disadvantaged. And that you're there to serve that population, whether it's an employee or a client or a patient. You're there to serve this community.

And so how do you, I don't know. I just felt like I had a real responsibility to treat people with not only respect, but to once, you know, you can't unknow, and so how do you integrate that in a legally compliant way? When sometimes your attorneys might be saying, you need to do it this way, or you need to do it that way, you know, so it's, it gets really complex really quickly.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. That's really interesting because really it comes down to your idea of serving people and serving the community, and a trauma informed approach is your tool to do that, to

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: I'm curious, and uh, I'm only using my kind of imagination here, when you, it sounds like you believe in like [00:10:00] service and serving others. do you think that might have anything to do with your upbringing, like at, at, uh, you know, a, a service provider overseas from your family? 'cause your, your, your folks might have been like this, this service kind of, figures.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, I've given a lot of thought to that recently. Um, in the year that my grandpa, um, he passed away last February. Maybe it was a couple Februarys ago, and so we've learned a lot about him or been reminded of things. Um, he was a forest service ranger, so he was fighting fires. He was making sure that, you know, campsites were clean.

And so he, and he really, even after retiring, I remember him getting awards like 10, 15 years later for his work as a volunteer because he just basically never stopped working. He would just always serve even after he retired. And [00:11:00] even eventually they did tell him like, Hey, we have to, we have to let you go now you have to rest you like you have to stop.

And so, um, so yeah, I do think that that, and then my dad working for the military, I do think that, I think also our religion was very heavy on service and I did at one point kind of take a step back and say like. What level of service is as an obligation is healthy.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hmm.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And I think for me it's also more about ethics and um, integrity more so than service.

Um, and I do now adopt a humanist perspective that, you know, instead of praying to a God and hoping that they're going to fix the world, we really need to take our own hands and feet. And move the world to change. And that's what's more powerful or most powerful in my mindset, is when we just come together and we clean up our community or we, [00:12:00] you know, help, um, feed, feed somebody that's hungry.

Those types of things are really Yeah, just speaks to the, it's, I think it's beyond ServiceNow, it's more about integrity and doing the right thing.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, I appreciate that. And I know there, there are connections be between being trauma informed and, um, holding kind of the importance of ethics and integrity. I know there's a connection between them. Um, but I also want to make sure that our listeners have a proper understanding of, uh, trauma informed. So could you just explain a little bit to us, you know, from your perspective, what is the trauma informed HR approach?

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. Um, so trauma informed, you know, I mentioned that, um, in that specific environment we would have counselors with a background of, um, chemical dependency and they would be, [00:13:00] in our environment, help. You know, they'd go back into that environment to help others. And in that process, they would hear about, you know, if you're trying to stay clean and sober.

You wanna remove yourself from those family and friends that got you into it in the first place. But if you're going back to serve in that environment to help other people, there's, it's unavoidable to not hear about active drug use every day. So some days you're gonna be strong and and have no problem, and other days it might trigger you.

Now, where it got personal for me was that I went into that environment hearing that, um. You know, thinking, well, I don't have any history of drug abuse, so I'm, I'm kind of safe in this environment. But what I learned is that there's other things that come out. There's burnout, there's, you know, your, your own relationships come out.

Um, I had my own childhood, uh, you know, abuse triggered and.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: [00:14:00] That led to some things, um, changing in my life. Um, and so if we step out of that environment and we just look at any environment, we all bring our own histories, our own human histories. And so when we're working in, you know, tech, which might be a non traditionally, like a non-trauma environment, we're still gonna have those relationship tendencies.

Those maybe fear, fear of authority, or maybe. We're gonna have these, these personality traits that come out and are almost compulsive.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hmm.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Um, and then you can also take it into like, you know, an emergency room or emergency department. They're gonna see things that are traumatic on a human level. And again, some days it doesn't affect them, and some days it does.

And so a trauma-informed organization builds into their business model. That these are a standard part of business. So a hospital might have a meeting afterwards where [00:15:00] if they have a super traumatic um, death, they might have those same practitioners come and talk about it and debrief about that. And they have a place to grieve.

They have a place to cry, they have a place to share a story or laugh, cry, those human things that a lot of times we don't take time for in business. Um, and so. You know, with the chemical dependency, we were able to build in the idea that, hey, this relapse is part of recovery, and so we might have this happen on a regular basis, and we need to be able to handle that as an org because if we, if we just fired somebody or, or went through the last chance agreement.

We may run out of clinicians that are licensed in this area and we may have to close our doors. So how do we handle this in a way that's human, that's practical and that's, um, evidence-based.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Ah, I like that. I like the evidence based part. 'cause we, everyone in the modern world [00:16:00] talk about data informed, data informed, like where is the data? And I think the data and evidence have pointed us to like, you know, being trauma informed actually works. And I really like you pointing out, you know, we have to build this approach into business and into management because this is not just like, oh, it's nice to take care of people.

It's nice to know what's going on. No, it's a requirement where required, we should be required to understand what's going on so that leadership can actually show up for their people.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Well, when you take an example of, let's just say I'm, I guess without saying a name of the company, let's just think of like a really large shipping storefront. That's everywhere. You know, I was doing some recruiting for, um, a plant that was gonna open 25. We have one in Portland here, like maybe we have like two or three, but they were gonna [00:17:00] open 25 in Atlanta and they kept.

Having trouble finding staff. And so they hired a recruitment firm and I was partnered with them and we were, we were talking behind the scenes of, is this something we can even do? Because I think they needed something like each, each facility needed like 25,000 people or something. It was like some really astronomical number.

And what we found was that this. Business had burned their bridges with the staff, the potential workforce in that area to where nobody wanted to come back because their business was built around three years. Work people really hard for three years at that point. They're either, you know, some of them were disabled from the job, some of them were just burned out and some of 'em just couldn't do it anymore.

I mean, of course there were people that still worked there, but they found that they were building these facilities and they didn't think [00:18:00] through the workforce. And so to me that's a worst case scenario of you've already burned people to where they don't wanna work for you. And now those are the only people that you can rely on and you've already built this facility.

So it's really interesting to think about that. 'cause that was in 2020 and I haven't followed up with that company to see what happened. But I am very curious if they were able to build their 25 facilities that they wanted. Um, because yeah, as a recruitment, you know, as recruiters we were, we decided we can't do that.

Like there's. We're not gonna be able to meet that order, and so we're not going to follow through on that.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, that seems like it. It, that seems like building facilities without good foundations.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. I will be curious too. 'cause 25 facilities a lot.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. And they, I know they rely on robots a lot for a lot of their workforce, but, um, but there are things that they need humans to do.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. Yeah. Good examples. And I'm sure [00:19:00] there are a lot of, like HR practitioners out there would be nodding and say like, yes, like we come across this kind of misalignment a lot. Um, I think oftentimes it is because we don't think about, like you mentioned earlier, we're all humans and we are bringing our own human histories. And without that basic understanding, it will be really hard to build a lasting business or like a strong team. Um, I am curious to kind of go back to the beginning when you mentioned. you know, you grew up in Japan and you lived in different states and you traveled a lot in Asia as well, and your preferred way of traveling is to be able to immerse in the local kind of cultures. how has that kind of like traveler. [00:20:00] Experience being a traveler, I guess, or like a lifelong traveler since, uh, as a child, uh, formed your, um, perspective on trauma, personal experience. I imagine there's also empathy and patience as well the way.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, there's a story that, um, my brother and I both used in our college admissions and we had traveled to Thailand and I remember we visited, I think this was in Chang Mai or Chang Rai, but it was very remote area of Thailand, and we saw. You know, I'll tell that from my perspective as an American, I saw the pound, like a truck, the pound, you know, pull up.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Okay.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And in, in America, you know, or on base, they'd be picking up an animal that's being, um, [00:21:00] not, you know, that's, that's loose, that they don't know who the owner is. And then we saw that, and then we went into the home, um, of the locals and we saw that the dogs were in, there were three or four in a really small crate.

And we asked our interpreter and they shared with us that that would be the family's dinner for the next few weeks, or, you know, and, and I just remember thinking just how thin the dogs were and how small it was. Also how much this family probably did need to survive on these animals, you know? And like the same way that we would on chicken or whatever, whatever else we might eat in America.

But I just know that that had a really profound impact on me of like how you can't make assumptions and you can't judge somebody for their living situation. Like we all come from different parts of the world. With our own [00:22:00] understanding. Um, and, you know, just, just the differences. I mean, I remember that there was, um, and you know, this is a really popular area, at least at the time for photographs.

Like people would

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: I see.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: come and they'd pay for photographs and, um. You know, like just the difference in dental care, things like that. And as I've learned more as an adult, I realize now like the ways that like our country impacts other countries or like the systems that are in place that kind of keep, keep access to resources and, and, um, there's still a lot I'm learning in this, but it's just that.

We really can't judge, and that we are all part of, you know, systems that lead us to the places where we are in life and the access that we have, or the privilege that we are afforded. Um, and how seeing the world, it just, it does change you and, um. [00:23:00] And so, yeah, so that, that was something that really, um, made an impact on, on myself and my brother.

I know, um,

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: I can, me. Really resonate with that is that actually a friend of mine,

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: I.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: excuse me, day, we were talking about how of the people in the US have never seen. Where their food is from. Like they don't know what food actually looks like. Like my friend and I, like he's from, his family is from Italy and I'm from China. So we talk about how we would eat the organs, right? Like of animal, it's like we would eat the heart, we would eat the liver, we will eat guts, et cetera, et cetera. And for a lot of folks in the US they probably will be like [00:24:00] right? The thing is from a long time ago, like maybe now, some of these dishes have become like delicacy, et cetera, but really originally they are for survival. like we don't waste food.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: If we are going to eat an animal, we gonna make sure that we eat the animal. Like it's also out of the respect of Mother Nature. What they, what she provides us and we make sure we, we don't waste her resource.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: you know, from thousands of years ago, we do that out of survival.

And also our relationship with nature is like that. And that reminds me of your, you know, story is like this family had had to eat those animals. But it's not malicious. It's not because they are bad or anything. It's, that's their life. Like they need that food to survive. [00:25:00] So I really resonate with the no judgment and no assumption thing because I do think that is very kind of, um, uh, a very American centered kind of way of thinking.

And we just, we tend to jump into conclusion very quickly these days.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Well, and I, I wonder too, how much has been, how much of it is always there and how much of it's becoming, um, when you were mentioning that, it made me think about my grandma. And so my, my grandfathers would both, um, hunt deer.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Hmm.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And they would, you know, use that every year like for feeding the family. And I remember my grandpa, that's the forest ranger, I remember when I was older asking him about hunting.

And I remember him saying that he wasn't really into it anymore, but the whole family kind of goes and it's a big thing every [00:26:00] year. But he's like, yeah, I'm not really, for me growing up it was survival. It was how we. We, we had to, um, we had to catch deer to survive. And now he's like, it's just sport. A lot of the meat goes to waste.

Um, a lot of the people that are hunting don't even like to eat the meat. Um, and so he, it kind of lost. Yeah. I could tell he wasn't, he wasn't, um. Into it anymore. And what was also interesting is at the time I was vegetarian and I remember being so surprised by some of my uncles and grandpas that were supportive of me being vegetarian when others around me were not supportive.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Interesting.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: They would surprise us by saying, well, actually I think that's a great way to live. Or, um, you know, just, and my grandpa was one of those people. Um, and I remember also that my grandma, he would save her the liver of the deer and the heart because she liked. That's a part that [00:27:00] of the animal that she liked.

And I just thought that was really, you know, of course I was judging her at that age. I was like, Ew. But, um, but she was like, no, like it's really good for you. And, um, and so I do just wonder how much we're losing, even with my own sons not having the tie to the male part of the family as much. Um, you know, they haven't been hunting, they haven't done some of those male rituals and mm-hmm.

I think that there are some things that we're losing, um, in terms of our ability to survive. And also maybe, you know, there's new ways that we can live as well that hopefully don't require such violence or, um, you know, getting our hands as dirty, but.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, I agree. I mean, there are so many rituals in the world that, that are really profound and just very hard to explain in a strictly modern way. Like we have a lot of indigenous wisdom. We ha we have [00:28:00] a lot of like passed down knowledge that, you know, time and time again has been proven true. But if you really wanna say easy scientific, easy, like. Again, proven like, that's hard to say. But, thank you for sharing your family story. Um, and I also want to kind of out of my curiosity, um, and you mentioned, you know, seeing the world changes you and I agree and I hope that that change is for the better version of ourselves. Um, I feel like seeing the world, um. Hopefully it makes me more of a empathetic person, just to understand there are many different ways to live um, there's not necessarily the right way or the wrong way. and, uh, from earlier I caught you say, [00:29:00] um, living in Asia and travel around and seeing the world taught you what America could be. can you elaborate on that a little bit?

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, so when I moved back I remember just hearing like things that were just outwardly racist and I was like, it was just shocking, um, to hear that, um, because in the military we had. I had teachers of, I had Japanese teachers, I had black teachers, I had PE teachers from all over the world, um, and all over the us um, as well.

And so I. I had friends that were from different backgrounds and I did start to notice when I got to about fifth grade, I was, I remember I had a friend, Jocelyn, who was from the Philippines, and I remember thinking like, oh wow, like we used to be really close. And we did start to kind of segregate as we got older.

Um, but, [00:30:00] but yeah, coming back to the US and, um, it was interesting, even just like. In the military, we had people move in all the time and it was like a privilege to show them around. Um, and so we would all kind of fight over who got to show the new kid around the first few days. And when I moved to Spokane, it was like no one raised their hand.

And it was funny, like looking back at pictures. I was kinda like in mean girls when the girl moves back from Africa because like I saw myself in this picture, I was looking through my photo albums and I found this picture of me in a choir concert. And you know, all the other girls, they're all like wearing like American Eagle or whatever, and I'm in my outfit that I got in Thailand, you know, and I just stuck out like a sore thumb.

Not only was I like taller than everybody at the time, but it was like, just like I just related with that movie so much. Um, but yeah. But so there were only one or two people that raised their hand [00:31:00] eventually to show me around and then I found out they were like the outcast and. And it wa there was, yeah, there was kind of immediately bullying, not necessarily towards me, but towards people that tried to be kind to me as a new kid.

Um, and, and yeah, it was just like a very, um, you know, very an area where people haven't really left the town, their parents haven't left the town. Um, and so yeah, it was just quite a shock to move, um, from Japan to Spokane. Um. So, um, so yeah, I do feel like it's, it's just really, I've always just wondered why we don't learn at least how to speak Spanish, right?

Like, like, why can we not, why are we not taught how to communicate with our neighbors?

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, I know. I mean, that's a heavy question. Why don't we like, why don't we learn how to communicate with our neighbors? I [00:32:00] mean. Spanish definitely is one thing. And then French, right. Our, our neighbors in the north, a lot of them speak French. It's, yeah, I mean, I heard this joke so many times. It's like if you, if you say like, who in the world only speak one language, it's probably Americans, It's like, it's 'cause it's like English only. And I feel in European countries, because they're so connected people, more or less speak. Other languages on top of their mother tongue as well. And of course in China a lot of people learn to speak Japanese or like Cantonese. Of course, that's our, another language and with neighboring countries.

So there are all kinds of languages going on, uh, in China. So I think, I don't know. I feel that question is very deep. It's like, why don't we, again, it's this kind of like. American centric, that, that [00:33:00] kind of mindset. Um, it's definitely interesting and I want to point out that the fact that the folks who air quotes, you know, outcast who actually showed you compassion and empathy and showed you around and they got bullied and

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: you know, sometimes he just like, man, kids are hard.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and I think Spokane especially like, I don't know what it is, but they just, um, you know, it's funny 'cause I did move briefly to Idaho first and we were there three months and my mom couldn't take it. And we moved. But the kids there were very friendly, very welcoming. It was Mountain Home, Idaho, and I just had really great.

Friends that I was developing there. Um, but yeah, they moved us to Spokane. I think just, you know, my mom wasn't loving it in Idaho, but, um, but yeah, but it was such a [00:34:00] different experience. And at that point, actually, I went from a sixth grade in elementary school in Japan to middle school in Idaho, back to elementary in the same year.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Wow.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: So, yeah, that was, that was pretty wild to be back in elementary school.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: 'cause you had to catch up like 'cause of different kind of education systems. They work different.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Well, it was, yeah. It was just, sixth grade was junior high in Idaho, but it was elementary school in Japan and in, um, Spokane. Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Interesting. Um, just out of curiosity, 'cause you mentioned Gros. Do you celebrate October three?

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: No,

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: That was the mean, right? Like the internet, like October three is Ming Girls Day or something.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: that's so funny. I, I see those pop up like to like, you know, we'll all wear, or orange is the new pink or whatever it might be, you know.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Um, I see things like that, but I haven't kept track [00:35:00] enough.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: I mean, I, I've only seen that movie once, I think, and I entirely didn't remember October three, but every year it pops up in my feed like Domingo. I don't know. But um,

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: I know like May the fourth, or it's gonna be May

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: you know the Backstreet Boys one.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: gonna have to dig out that picture now that we talked about this and post it because see if anybody else thinks that it looks like the mean girls scene.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. Yeah, you have to now you must. That's really interesting. I mean, it also kind of like demonstrates. It's not like isolated, um, situation like say in mean girls, this, this young moved back to the states from Africa and in your case is from Japan. We actually have a lot of children from family who serve in the military or like, you know, for parents doing research [00:36:00] in other countries and a lot of them had a hard time, you know, integrating back to the US and become part of the kind of culture again. Um, so I almost feel that could be a very cool research project for someone, you know, in the academic area. It's like, what can we learn from these people who are Americans, but grew up outside of the US and then come back and try to integrate again?

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, I heard so a friend of mine, um, grew up in Switzerland or Sweden and then also in Canada, and she shared something with me that was talking about, I can't remember what, there's a name for people like us who kind of don't have that like home base. Um, and have, you know, lived overseas and I'll have to look that up.

But anyways, she had shared that there were some resources for people like us. Um, and there's a name, it wasn't expat, it wasn't expats, it was [00:37:00] something else. Yeah, it was like, it had something to do with like, kind of like a third, I don't know, I think of it like third party, but I don't remember what the name was.

But anyway, there was, there was a name for us, so I thought that was interesting.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. I mean if you share, we'll, we'll add that in the show notes 'cause I will be curious to learn that term as well. I mean, that feels like a certain kind of group of a population that, I don't know, have a support group of some sort. Um, so remind me, when did you move to Portland More kind of permanently.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: So I moved here in, um, let's see, it was basically January of 2016.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Okay. Oh really? So

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yes. Yep. And that'll be the longest I've lived anywhere.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Wow. That's

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: I was trying to think. Yeah, I was like, I think from 12 to [00:38:00] 18 I was in Spokane, so that was probably the longest before 12. So yeah, six years was my longest before.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Wow. Oh, so fascinating and it almost makes me, just so curious, like that part of your life is like always kind of trying to grow roots, but for some reason it was never complete. now it feels like you are growing roots and you are building your business in Portland. That's just really beautiful

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: and

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And I did think about too, because I've always been counting down to when I can move

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: really,

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: where I can move somewhere sunny.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: yeah. I.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And it's been a whole exercise in like, no, like you can't leave. You have to stay like, um, 'cause I really want my kids to grow in this. In one school. And so it's been, it's been a weird shift over the last couple [00:39:00] years to where I've said even probably even this last year, I've said, wow, like maybe I'm not gonna want to leave.

Like maybe this is home and I'm going to miss this. I'm gonna miss these relationships and these, these places, and what would it be like to stay, and especially now building my business, there was even a moment of like. Do I build my business here?

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And I was like, no, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna stay. And it's been really great to have that.

Um. Those people that have really embraced and been excited, um, and supported it, um, in a different way than I would've ever had before. You know, never had this type of, wow. Remember when our kids were little, um, you know, wow, this was six years ago,

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: know, Halloween, they were doing this and those kinds of things.

It's been really, really interesting to have that.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: the continuity, like there is a continu in your life. It, it's not like it doesn't evolve too much moving [00:40:00] around and the stability for your child's life as well. Children, child, how many kids? Okay.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Children. I have two, um, ninth grade and junior in high school.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, it's critical time for them as well, you know, as teenagers. Um, and I think it's really cool, like you will think about, oh, maybe I can stay, maybe I don't have to move. Maybe I don't want to move.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: that's such a cool feeling as well.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Um,

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: it's been huge around the weather because the sun is what I miss the most and just the predictability of walking outside and, you know, um, but I've just embraced the rain now and like if it's raining, I'm going on my walk anyway.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Thing I

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Like that's a weird, that's a weird thing. 'cause I, I was talking with a friend yesterday, um, and she was saying that when she moved here from the Bay Area.

It was raining so they didn't go grocery shopping. And then three months or three weeks later, they're like, well, I guess we have to go shopping because this is not going to stop. [00:41:00] Because like in some areas you just don't go out if it's raining. You know? And I, I had to learn that of like, I don't need to cancel plans just 'cause it's raining.

Like I'm just gonna go.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm. It took me a while too, and now I'm just like, you know what? It's gonna rain, so I, we can't. We can, you know, plan our lives so much around the rain, whatnot. Sometimes you just have to do it. Uh, that's interesting. Wow. Not going out for like three weeks and then like, oh, I guess I have to go buy food.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Um, and you have been growing trauma-informed HR in Portland, and I imagine perhaps outside of Portland as well. And can you share a little bit about how staff been going? And also of course, how do people get in touch with you and, uh, work with you?

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, so I'm on LinkedIn, Shay Noble and um, [00:42:00] should be pretty easy to find there. I also have, um, Instagram and on. Uh, LinkedIn. I'm trauma-informed HR as well, so that's a great way to get ahold of me. Um, and it's been going really well. I've, um, found some networking groups that are really helpful and closed a few clients already.

One of them is a trauma informed, um. Network for neurological or neuro, neuro atypical children to get support at home. Um, and they're actually based out of Kirkland, Washington. So I'm finding that it's very, um, you know, that's the nice thing about HR is it's not particularly geographic, but, uh, as long as you know, the state laws, you're pretty good to work from anywhere.

Um. Yeah, it's just been very, um, I found a lot of reception, um, from people and, um, [00:43:00] and, and yeah, I think too, just on the individual level, there's a lot of people that need support. You know, if they're in a job that they can't leave because of benefits or they can't leave because of, um, you know, just whatever, you know, maybe they haven't found something else and how to help them get through that.

Because they, you know, you sometimes you can't leave. It's almost like an abusive relationship, right?

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: You, why don't they leave? Well, they don't leave because there's too many things that they're dependent on in that relationship. So, um, so yeah, so I'm finding that that's, you know, there's a lot of interest around that as well.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah, I mean, I really feel like organizations should work with you because just, just this year alone, I can't imagine how much trauma has been, you know, um, I don't know. It's, it, it just has been a pretty intense year and, a lot of people are experiencing trauma or [00:44:00] being triggered by trauma from previous lives. I hear that kind of stories all the time now, and I really do think, you know, organizations, especially people in leadership, should really, um, take the trauma informed approach when it comes to people and culture, not just HR really. It's just like, just just be human and take care of people and take, uh, take care of each other.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah. Well, and with, you know, like just taking for example, ice, like with the ICE raids, it's like, you know, we used to have Sanctuary city and you know, an ability to rely on that. And then now it's like you have to make a decision. Like, here's what our lawyers are advising. Here's what our, um, here's what our employees are fearing.

How much of it is people not wanting to come into work? How much of it is people truly being afraid?

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: I see.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: And then whatever decision you make, you still could have your employees rioting. You could still [00:45:00] have them doing against your policy, or you could still have, um. You know, your policy needing to evolve very quickly.

And so it's like we've, we've had to be on pins and needles to say like, how are we going to respond? And even like our own personal ethics might come in or might even be in opposition from someone else. And so there's a lot of, um, you know, what I like to think about is just the calm that having trauma informed, um.

Practices can do. Even the fact of people taking their vacations or being rested, having, you know, feeling like they can take a time, they can take time away from work and not have the whole, um, you know. The whole company sink from one person taking time off, you know? But people do get that way, you know, when they feel triggered, they might feel like they're the only one holding the business together.

And so a, a good sign of an, of a healthy [00:46:00] environment is when people feel they can take time off. So there's some indicators that we can use to help calm and allow us to slow down enough to make judicious decisions. Versus responding to the multiple fires that are coming at us every day.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm. And that sounds like reactive 'cause you feel like you have to. Put out a fire. Otherwise it's like, what are you gonna do? But,

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: and, and that doesn't provide a calm kind of environment, so we really need to, know, approach things in a human way.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Mm-hmm.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Um, so yeah, that's really helpful. Uh, so yeah, I, we will make sure to share your, uh, personal LinkedIn as well as, uh, business, LinkedIn and website of course, uh, in our show notes. Um, and as we wrap up our conversation, I want to invite you to maybe as a trauma informed HR [00:47:00] expert, if there's one piece of advice you can give to. Um, leaders like today, like in this time of the world, that in this world we live in now, if there's one piece of device, like what would you give leaders?

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: So my piece of advice would be to remember the pendulum of progress. It moves forward and it may move back, but it will eventually swing forward again and. When you feel the pressure, you feel the fear, you feel the what ifs just bombarding. You just remember that abundance mindset of there's plenty.

There are people who think like me, there are people who need this. And there are people who are going to rally around when we come from a scarcity mindset of there's not enough. I'm the only person, no one [00:48:00] else is thinking through this. Those types of things, those limiting beliefs, it can really have a damaging impact on how we show up.

And so just trying to embrace the fact that we are making progress. It feels like we're not sometimes, but. Sticking to your values, sticking to your community, finding community if you don't have one, and just trying to really focus on the fact that we are enough and we are going to get through this.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: That's what I think is really important right now.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: Thank you. That is very grounding. Thank you for bringing up the abundance mindset. I think it is so true. It's like we, we are making progress and we, there's, you can't deny that. Um, so even, especially in a tough, tough time that we have to remember this abundance for us all. Um, like you said, I see enough and, um, we will get through this.

[00:49:00] Um, but most importantly really is to practice and, um, with the help of trauma informed, uh, approach when it comes to HR work. So

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Yeah.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: yeah. Thank you so much, SHA, for coming on today.

shae-noble--she-they-_1_11-24-2025_140025: Thank you so much, Joe for having me. It was been a pleasure to chat with you today.

zhou_1_11-24-2025_140025: thank you. I'll stop recording here.

​